05
Oct
12

This, That and the Other

@OFA_VA: Some of these folks have been out here since 9PM last night. Excited? We think so.

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AP

George Mason University, Fairfax, Virginia, Oct 5

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Paul Krugman: …. Today’s full-scale freakout over a decent jobs report is a sight to behold …. it’s ridiculous to imagine that the Obama administration could arrange (on short notice, no less) to cook the jobs numbers. The sheer logistics would be impossible, plus these are civil servants who have to live under both parties.

…. The thing is, although such antics are funny in a way, they’re also menacing. By attacking anyone who presents awkward facts, the right exerts an intimidating effect. It won’t get the BLS to retract today’s jobs report, but it might bully news organizations into avoiding objective economic analysis, and maybe even into blurring their reporting right now.

So this is crazy and stupid; but it’s also scary.

More here

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Steve Benen: The death of a talking point

If I had a nickel for every time Mitt Romney has said the unemployment rate has been above 8% throughout the Obama presidency, I’d have, well, nearly as much money as Mitt Romney.

Today, however, the talking point died. The unemployment rate fell unexpectedly, dropping from 8.1% to 7.8%.

Full post here

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Cagle

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BuzzFeed

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BuzzFeed: Romney Misstates Reason For Unemployment Rate Drop:

“The reason it’s come down this year is primarily due to the fact that more and more people have just stopped looking for work.”

But the labor force has actually grown since the start of the year….

More here

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Greg Sargent: Mitt Romney’s selection of Paul Ryan as his vice presidential nominee has drawn national attention to Ryan’s Medicare plan. One measure of this: Rob Zerban, the Democrat challenging Ryan for his House seat in Wisconsin, has been able to raise some $770,000 for his race — outraising Ryan himself.

According to the Zerban campaign, 84 percent of his contributions come from outside Wisconsin, underscoring the intensity of feeling among Democrats nationally towards Ryan and his plan.

In this context, the new ad that Zerban is set to run against Ryan is worth watching….

More here

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Scout Tufankjian for Obama for America

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Next:

2:30: President Obama delivers remarks at Cleveland State University in Ohio

C-SpanCBS 1 * CBS 2 * CNN


49 Responses to “This, That and the Other”


  1. 1 proudmemberofglobalzero
    October 5, 2012 at 1:38 pm

    Fired up in FL and ready to GO!!

  2. 3 yardarm756
    October 5, 2012 at 1:40 pm

    Top 10. Hooray!

  3. 7 Zekke LyDonna
    October 5, 2012 at 1:40 pm

    The Dominoes are beginning to fall. Are we having fun yet?

  4. 14 57andFemale
    October 5, 2012 at 1:49 pm

    That first photo: the crowd on average is 50 years younger than the old codgers behind Mitt today.

  5. October 5, 2012 at 1:51 pm

    What ho, peeps?

    Just woke up, and of course, the first thing I did was to come here and see the BLS numbers.

    Holla!!! Under 8% UEI!!

    I hope Mitt enjoyed his “win”. It’s the last one he’ll get.

  6. 32 dudette9t9
    October 5, 2012 at 1:58 pm
    • 33 donna dem 4 obama
      October 5, 2012 at 2:05 pm

      So I’m hearing that this started with Morning Joke and then Jack Welch the former CEO of GE who tweeted that this was Chicago cooking the books. What a bunch of buffoons!!!

    • 34 Ladyhawke
      October 5, 2012 at 2:14 pm

      There are never any complaints about the accuracy of the unemployment numbers when they are high. Bad number are not suspect. Good numbers are always some nefarious plot to deceive the public. The problem that the Republican Party is having with the good unemployment numbers is that their obstruction has not created the results they wanted before the election. This just wasn’t supposed to happen. It wasn’t in the cards. They were so sure they had done enough filibustering, delaying, obstructing, sabotaging and hostage taking to keep the UE numbers through the roof. Now it’s time to move the goalposts again and harp on nutty conspiracy theories. The Republican Party has become a joke.

  7. 35 PamfromCalif
    October 5, 2012 at 2:02 pm

    Jobs numbers is very Good news for the US Economy, President Obama & Big Bird. Thank you chips for this wonderful site; I read it daily.

  8. 38 lisalovesobama
    October 5, 2012 at 2:03 pm

    More on the Gish Gallop which Willard used on debate night:

    “In written form, a Gish Gallop is most commonly observed as a long list of supposed facts or reasons, as a pamphlet or green ink web page, with a title that proudly boasts the number of reasons involved. To truly qualify as a Gish Gallop, this number must be at least 50 – a “top 10″ list isn’t really what this is about – and many truly epic examples hit triple figures. The individual points must also be fairly terse; often to the point where, individually, each point is easy to refute because it simply proves nothing. But combined, a Gish Gallop might run into the same length as a multi-page essay running into thousands of words. This provides insight into the motives of the Gish Galloper, as there seems to be some conflict between the scale of the Gallop and the shortness of the individual points. If brevity and ease-of-understanding was the aim (as suggested by short, easy-to-digest points) then they would be better off with a smaller number of points, like “the best five reasons” or “the top ten arguments.” These not only stick in the mind of a reader, but also form a core argument that can be expanded on. If, on the other hand, a coherent and thorough argument was the intention (as suggested by the excessive word count), then the purpose would be best served by using the thousands of words expended in the Gallop to make a full essay, with points expanded and elaborated on to ensure they were thoroughly argued. By taking a curious middle ground, a Gish Gallop tries to create the illusion of authority and an incredible weight of evidence by sheer quantity alone, without any quality to back it up. To supporters, the illusion works, but those who disagree with the Galloper’s points often find the amount of repetitive assertions and non-explanations offered tedious to deal with.

    “The gallop is often used as an indirect argument from authority, as it appears to paint the “galloper” as an expert in a broad range of subjects and the opponent as an incompetent bumbler who didn’t do their homework before the debate. Such emphasis on style over substance is the reason many scientists disdain public debates as a forum for disseminating opinions.

    It is often successfully combined with the “point refuted a thousand times” (PRATT). The gallop must consist of as many points as possible, and even old and worn out arguments are useful in overwhelming the respondent and bamboozling the audience. The technique also takes advantage of the one single proof fallacy, since if a respondent only manages to refute 99 out of 100 points there is still one point that proves the galloper correct. The galloper takes to heart Joseph Stalin’s advice that “quantity has a quality all its own.”

    “The gallop is often used as an indirect argument from authority, as it appears to paint the “galloper” as an expert in a broad range of subjects and the opponent as an incompetent bumbler who didn’t do their homework before the debate. Such emphasis on style over substance is the reason many scientists disdain public debates as a forum for disseminating opinions.

    It is often successfully combined with the “point refuted a thousand times” (PRATT). The gallop must consist of as many points as possible, and even old and worn out arguments are useful in overwhelming the respondent and bamboozling the audience. The technique also takes advantage of the one single proof fallacy, since if a respondent only manages to refute 99 out of 100 points there is still one point that proves the galloper correct. The galloper takes to heart Joseph Stalin’s advice that “quantity has a quality all its own.”

    A related distraction technique, familiar to readers of A Storehouse of Knowledge, involves swamping an opponent in long-winded screeds of text to artificially inflate the appearance of depth and quality of information presented. Quite often, the actual content of several paragraphs can be summed in a sentence. While the Gish Gallop floods an opponent with many, but relatively short points, argumentum ad tl;dr flings text walls so massive and impenetrable that even Victor Hugo would blush. Both tactics, however, have exactly the same purpose: to bury and obfuscate the core points that need to be discussed under a quantity of superfluous information. A user might well think that these techniques show that they know what they’re talking about, but in the end they act simply as distractions. Note that both are different (but not mutually exclusive) from argumentum ad nauseam, which bolsters the apparent credibility of the argument simply by repeating the same thing over and over and over and over again.

    For example, Jason Lisle’s blog posts and “research paper” about the anisotropic synchrony convention prattle on endlessly about relativistic physics, hiding the fact that his fundamental assumptions were, to say the least, a little far-fetched. Similarly, engineer Dewey Larson has written numerous books on his theories about matter, going on for pages and pages about the need for critical thinking and letting evidence fit hypotheses, when what he actually proposes in these weighty self-published tomes can be summed up in a medium-length sentence. ”

    It’s also supposed to make your opponent look like he is unprepared and didn’t do his home work. it’s designed to throw them off and make the galloper– Willard– look superior. It’s about style not substance.

    Can you believe this crap?!!!!!!!! Please tweet Team Obama about this. The more you know…..Also tweet Lawry and Rachel about this crap!!!

    • 39 miss pat
      October 5, 2012 at 2:44 pm

      Romney thought he was ging to bluff his way to the White House. He has to work hard and earn it and the man has never worked hard for anything.

      Trust me, the President is going to tear him a new backside and we all can sit back and say, okay, that was the plan: Let the man think he won then beat his backside the next time.

      The President kept his cool for a reason, plus he has to present himself a certain way.

      Can’t be the angry Black man, can’t walk over to the fool and knock him the hell out.

      He got it, trust him, he got it. Everything will work out for the greater good. Thank God for you Lisa, you always make me feel better.

    • October 5, 2012 at 3:17 pm

      This is so important, Lisa. I would like to see a hash tag for gishgallop and make the term widely known, so as many people as possible know what Romney was up to. I suspect he’s been trained by Luntz, etc. Conflate and confuse.

      The name is from a creationist named Gish who used this technique to debate scientists and other opponents. Bombard them with so many deceitful arguments so very quickly that it becomes impossible to argue a single point without getting getting caught in a verbal conundrum. Many scientists have given up trying to debate with such people because it is nearly impossible to have an honest dialogue. This is the style of FOX, Limbaugh, climate change denialists, etc.

      I would love to see this covered by MSNBC hosts.

  9. 41 squarepeg
    October 5, 2012 at 2:08 pm

    This goes without saying, but – do NOT watch Jon Stewart. He also seemed thrilled that Obama “lost” the debate.

    • 42 Jeff
      October 5, 2012 at 2:15 pm

      Attacking him on twitter.

      • 43 anniebella
        October 5, 2012 at 2:22 pm

        Have we not learn anything about Jon Stewart? “F” Jon Stewart. And I don’t mean forget.

        • 44 anniebella
          October 5, 2012 at 2:25 pm

          The other guy is funnier than Stewart, Steve Colbert. I don’t watch either one really.

          • 45 EricFive
            October 5, 2012 at 3:10 pm

            Colbert is far funnier and a better liberal than Stewart could ever hope to be. Stewart self-righteously blasts the CNN “Crossfire” mentality, and then goes on to endorse this form of “debate” on the Presidential level. His is not consistent with his bullshit.

    • 46 pkayden
      October 5, 2012 at 2:44 pm

      Jon Stewart is trying to be funny. He seems to lean more towards the Left, although I understand why some would find him annoying with his “both sides do it” meme.

  10. 47 amk for obama
    October 5, 2012 at 2:10 pm

    The Sound of Crickets: Conservative Sites Silent about GOP Voter-Registration Fraud

    http://prospect.org/article/sound-crickets-conservative-sites-silent-about-gop-voter-registration-fraud

  11. October 5, 2012 at 2:12 pm

    I listened to my 20 seconds of Rush on the way home at noon – did you know Rush actually predicted the 7.8% jobs number back in May?? He even played a clip to “prove” it – the sound of his voice saying “mark my words, they will have it below 8% by election day”. He’s such a smug smart-ass, he reminds me of my b-i-l! Unfortunately, my 20 seconds of Rush was up then – so I didn’t have to hear any more.

    Well guess what, Rush? I don’t believe you! I simply doubt that you had a tape of yourself from May saying that. I think you made it up, just to fit the situation today. How’s it feel, to have your word doubted? :-P

  12. October 5, 2012 at 2:19 pm

    Sorry everyone, new post already – I forgot the heads up was coming so soon :???:

    http://theobamadiary.com/2012/10/05/heads-up-president-obama-in-ohio-2/


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